2008-08-09 [Sauron]: You can always take the cookies for NOT removing her from the list...*wink wink*

2008-08-09 [Diede.]: No worries! I'll bake some new ones! *runs around hysterically*

2008-08-09 [Sauron]: (a note for you kids - corruption and crime does work out!)

2008-08-09 [Lithium Lullaby]: you have a lot of people, you just started this a couple days ago, right?

2008-08-09 [Ramirez]: It was started on August 7th, sometime in the evening, central time. =P

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: wow nice ^+^

2008-08-10 [Tynuka-Rhytishy]: I'm sure this wiki's going to blast off. It's to the point and that's how it should be. xD

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: It definately works. At this point, I was on the verge of leaving ET. It's become another myspace.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: [Lithium Lullaby]: Don't ever leave Elftown because you feel like you're alone here. As you can see from the growing numbers, people who love this website and the reasons for its making are still here and are starved for interaction with others like them. All those people on this list are probably more than willing to start up conversations and friendships.

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: That's why I asked to join. A part of me is here. Even if i did leave, it wouldn't be for long. I love this place.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: Why does it bother you guys that some people have boring houses and haven't contributed? Isn't it their choice to miss out? And it's your choice not to interact with those members...

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: it's not that it bothers us. But we do think that if you are going to be part of a fantasy community then you should at least try to stick to what it's supposed to be.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: The reason we're bothered is because an increasing number of ET member use the website for social networking purposes only. Half of them can't write, draw, or even take a decent photograph.

We're opposed to the people who are abusing what this website was created for. (:

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: *agrees*

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: [Imperator], yes it's their choice to miss out. This wiki is simply made for those people who want to interact with people who do want to use Elftown how it's suppose to, thus why becoming a member has to reach certain criteria. As I've said before, lots of people love Elftown, but not all of them use Elftown as it's intended. They're welcome to stay in Elftown, but this wiki isn't for them. If they consider theirself an art-critique, then they don't have to have a fancy ET house with their writing and art up, since they're contribute by helping others out by giving advice, ect.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: Does it really matter if they participate or not? And what kind of an impact to you hope to make with this group anyway? What's the point?

2008-08-10 [Byne]: ...I love how placating you are. But you make very good points, [Ramirez]

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: To give hope to those who think Elftown isn't going to make it.

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: Obviously, we care.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: "Isn't going to make it"? Don't you think that's an over-reaction consider that you have 36 members in two days? lol

2008-08-10 [Byne]: Which averages into 16.5 members a day. (:

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: But if you read back in the comments you will see that some of us were on the verge of leaving. That happens, this site WILL become another Myspace or Tagged or whatever. That's not what this site is about

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Yes, I'm obviously speaking broadly. My point is that we lose all kinds of great contributors every day because they feel like Elftown isn't what it use to be. I'm hoping to spread the word that there are still people who want to use this website as it's intended. I understand it's a controversial wiki, and I'm totally okay with a few people not liking it or finding it useless. There's 36 people who believe in this wiki and think it has good intents.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: Since when are some boring people a reason to leave?

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: We didn't join elftown because we wanted a place to cry and whine about how stressful life is and how much your love life sucks. There are plenty of sites for that.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Well, I don't know about you, but I find it incredibly disappointing and disheartening to come across a string full of 'my mummy doesn't love me' with a list of band names and bad statistics on irrelevant things with a "chat me up since I'm looking for a good sexy time" in a biography. That can be discouraging.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: That doesn't actually answer the question, [Lithium Lullaby]... Like I said, it's your choice to interact with those members.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: I understand that. It's just when 18/20 members that you come across are those people as described above, while those other 2/20 people actually use the website as intended, but maybe only 1 of those 2 is actually on daily or 2-3 times active a week.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: Do you believe those numbers to be accurate representation or are you just using it as an example? I'm pretty sure it isn't that extreme.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: I'm using it as an example. I have no proof of those being accurate, nor do I pretend they are.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: Mmhmmm... Alrighty.

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: if you don't believe in what this wiki stands for, why did you come here?

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: I'm just asking questions that came to mind. But I actually have no idea how I found this...

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: lol, questions are great. I don't mind. ^^ And... subliminal messages sent you here. >>

2008-08-10 [Lithium Lullaby]: featured wiki nominations maybe. Or my page. Or [Ramirez]'s

2008-08-10 [Mortified Penguin]: I agree with [Imperator]. Elftown was designed for both artists and hangarounds... If Hedda had a problem with the type of people here, he wouldn't let them become members in the first place.

And think about it... if the majority of the people here (apparently "18/20") act differently than what an Elftowner is supposed to act like, then that makes the people on this wiki a minority. And why should the minority get to tell the majority how to act? Maybe it is you who aren't acting in a traditional Elftown way... maybe your views are the wrong ones... who's to say what a legitimate Elftowner is anyway?

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: I think the way to put it, is that all of these blah people are really sucking away elftown's spirit. It's feel of community. Elftown is for creative people, and seeing such a lack of creativity or care really detracts from the entire... erh, elftown experience. You don't have to talk to these people, yes, but is disheartening to see just how many people are here for all the wrong reasons. It's the same unoriginal thing, over and over again. It gets to the point that I feel like I'm holding my breath underwater, and when I find an interesting unique house it's as though I can finally breath. It's a total downer zapping through the latest logins and see no one who you would even consider befriending. You feel alone, and relatively disgusted. It's not a fun experience. I have no trouble seeing how it could scare people away, especially the golden oldies who can feel the soul of elftown getting sucked right out of it. Which is why I think wikis like this are important in the elftownian community. So that we true elftowners can come together and hold each other up despite the invasion from the outside. 'Cause if we really care about et, we do need to step up in some way... either by donating or entering contests or posting in the forums or just... doing things like this to unite elftownies. There's nothing we can do but remind each other there are still awesome people here, and as long as they are, elftown wont completely become some teen venting garbage heap.

Wowa, kinda freaked myself out. Being all serious in a non-satirical way makes me dizzy and uncomfortable.

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: To Mort,

No. We became the minority, but we are the natives. They are the invaders. If we just sit back and wave, elftown wont be elftown anymore. It would be New Myspace. As the natives, as the creative people this site was designed for, we have every reason to be upset. Being in the minority doesn't mean we don't have any right to speak up. Hell, if that was the case, America would still have slaves.

2008-08-10 [XxTsomexX]: You make some very good points [NOOOPE]. I originally joined this site because my friend told me it was an artist community, but now, I see these people coming on here and they're talking about myspace. I personally think Myspace is a waste of internet space, but thats just my opinion. Most of the people on this wiki don't want to see Elftown become like that.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: I couldn't agree more, [NOOOPE].

2008-08-10 [Mortified Penguin]: If America still had slaves, we'd be a lot more productive. Nowadays, everyone is concerned with their fancy "wages" and "paychecks"...

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Wow.

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: You're so lucky I'm not black. I know that was sarcastic, but that was way out of line.

2008-08-10 [XxTsomexX]: That was messed up [Mortified Penguin]...

2008-08-10 [Mom]: I think it's amazing...I do believe Mort would argue with a fence post. lol

2008-08-10 [Mortified Penguin]: Hey, that fence post makes some good points.

2008-08-10 [Mortified Penguin]: It's true though. With slave labor, America would be much more productive... Of course, I never said that black people should be the slaves. You're the ones that thought that... you racists.

2008-08-10 [Mom]: An instigator if I ever saw one...every page I see with your postings you have everyone stirred up.

2008-08-10 [XxTsomexX]: Thats Mort for you... he does it all the time on my wikis...

2008-08-10 [Mortified Penguin]: What?! No I don't... how dare you all lie about me!

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: I'm going to have to politely ask that this conversation becomes PM, unless it can clean up and be discussed in a more respectable matter. =/ I don't mind discussion, it's just be thoughtful about what you're going to say. I'd rather not have this snowball into an angry tirade.

I understand some people feeling there's no need to have this wiki, and you're entitled to that opinion, but I am also allowed to have created this wiki and bring willing members of the community together. You don't have to agree with it, and you certainly don't have to join it, but you do need to respect the opinions here. On both sides, for and against it. Just please keep it G rated.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: *tirades angrily* I'm not against this wiki by any means, I'm just questioning some of the motives and objectives.

2008-08-10 [XxTsomexX]: *shrugs* I'm just gonna watch and see what happens.

2008-08-10 [Mom]: No motives...No Ojectives...just people who love ET.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: [Mom] just pretty much summed it up.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: *tirades angrily-er...* What? I'm not a member but I love ET! What are you saying about my loyalties?!

2008-08-10 [Mortified Penguin]: People who love Elftown, but hate it's members?

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: Hahahah, ok, just stop.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: ...Wow. I missed a lot, didn't I?

2008-08-10 [XxTsomexX]: Yes, yes you did [Byne].

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: I am completely against hate. I don't believe hating people accomplishes anything. This is not meant to hate anyone, it is meant to inspire people who don't use Elftown as it's intended to go out and do something and be grateful for the things Elftown offers artistically. I consider this an educational place, and an inspirational place. And I never said you could not be a member [Imperator]. You never asked, so I did not add you.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: Geez.... One would never have thought that this would cause any issues.

2008-08-10 [Mom]: This wiki is not causing issues. People are...

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: =/

2008-08-10 [Mom]: Oh smile...everyone takes life too serious.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: lol, gotta love that face.

2008-08-10 [The Scarlet Pumpernickle]: Ha! Mort... such a shit disturber. :P

I would like to see ideas about how we can get more people involved in all the great things ET has to offer. Lately I've noticed that the polls on Mainstreet are taking longer and longer to get voted on (whether because people ignore it or not enough active members) and tons of art contests are dying from a lack of interest. I've got a contest that I'm trying to drum up interest for.. but all the artist's that are interest are the "usual suspects" and I'd like to see some new blood!

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Yeah, I almost wonder if we should have people who go around reminding people about putting up their work. In a friendly manner, not in a bitchy way. Just ask if they're interested in ever putting up their work. Just to encourage people to do it. Obviously there'd be no consequences if they don't, but just reminding people and asking them. Kind of like the "So and so's birthday is today, have you forgotten?" It reminds you, but it does it in a friendly way. Then give advice and guidance to people who aren't sure what to put up, or think they don't have anything to offer. Everyone has an artist or writer in them.

2008-08-10 [The Scarlet Pumpernickle]: Ya, I try to do it in a friendly way kinda like "wow you're a great artist! Have you ever considered entering any Elftown Art contests?" Sometimes they do... sometimes they don't. But I haven't done it for a while *goes and does?*

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: Heh, we could do that every year on elftown's birthday.

2008-08-10 [The Scarlet Pumpernickle]: lol ya! Have a massive PARTY!!!!!!! FREE BADGES FOR ALL!! :P

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: AND BE CREATIVE, DAMNIT!

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: [NOOOPE], valid point, but I wonder if sending out a notification to every single member might be a little much for programing? I wouldn't know, I'm not educated on programming and all that. Do you guys think it'd be a good idea to put up a 'job description' for people to go around and message other artistically inactive members? Not saying you have to take the title to do it, but just to keep the idea alive at the very least, and of course they don't have to expect to do it every day, or to every person they come across. Just... sort of keep it in mind when browsing ET.

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: We could have more... I dunno rewards for doing so. Something sparkly declaring one is an elftown artist.

2008-08-10 [The Scarlet Pumpernickle]: Heck, I'd do it.. and will, but I've got a bed that's calling my name... so Tomorrow! (I have no life...) :P

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: lol, yes, something sparkly! Would that be awarded to all Elftown Artists? And we/you/someone just start dishing them out to people who have art up?

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: The thing is, with something like this, you either go all out, or you make a wiki, like a creativity wiki with badges/banners for creative imaginative people, but thing is, though giving things to everyone may be excessive, not a lot of people would notice a wiki unless it caught on fire, basically.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: That's true. I wonder if sometime later... Maybe put the number of people in the wiki in a hat, draw out two numbers, (until all numbers have been matched) and those two people make a 'badge' for each other, and we'll do it every month or two months or something. Just something small. It can be a few words, a poem, a short story. Just to give people something to do and to keep interacting with each other and experience styles. I don't want this wiki to die. I really don't. I know a lot of wiki's like this start out strong, but fizzle after a few months.

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: That sounds fun. Oh oh oh! Or like around christmas.... have an annual secret santa with art and shizz.... that would be fuuuun!

Maybe, just, establishing some new elftown traditions could snap some people awake, and thing not necessarily dependent on skill, like contests.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Yeah! That annual santa though... Might have to have a lot of Elf helpers. =P Unless they just want to give the same greeting/picture to every member, sending the holiday cheer. =D

As for Elftown traditions... hm... It would be good to get all members of Elftown together, not necessarily just the ones in this wiki, so I like that. Elftown does have a lot of traditions (I would like to hope), and I'm sure they'd have to be approved by [Hedda], but some brainstorming couldn't hurt.

2008-08-10 [Ryo-Oni]: YAR!!

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Yar matey?

2008-08-10 [Ryo-Oni]: Not quite, but it shall do.

BUT YAR! I BELIEVE IN ELFTOWN!

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Then, YAR. Ye shall be added, if you so desire.

2008-08-10 [Ryo-Oni]: And desire I do. :-B

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Welcome aboard. =)

2008-08-10 [Byne]: Pancakes are gross. O:

And the once a year thing sounds great to me. (:

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Don't you diss my pancakes. I am going to force feed you pancakes the entire week you're here just for that comment.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: I'llthrow them on your ceiling.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: =(

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]:

Everyone check out The Believers Coffee House OHMYGAD!

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Thanks so much for spicing that place up, [NOOOPE]. You did a wonderful job. =)

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: Wee! I'm glad I could help!

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Me too ^^

2008-08-10 [Byne]: It was PIMPED. Lulz. (:

2008-08-10 [Biokinetic]: So this is Briar_Hawk... *pokes Hiei aka Ramirez* pretty spiffity place you got here...sir...<_< >_> Good luck on ye

2008-08-10 [Paul Doyle]: All righty, short and sweet here---why so much love and sentiments for Elftown, circa 2002-04 before things generally started going downhill, despite the opening of Elfpack? Everyone has different views, different perspectives and such, but I think those of us old-timers can generally agree come to a consensus:

(1.) Elftown was annoying from a technical standpoint. It was underpowered, you couldn't upload didly-squat compared to what you can upload now, "privs" were an arcane hush-hush thing only known to a small handful of people, the forums were so confusing to use they were arcane on a level matched only by the Labyrinth of myth, and of course ET was constantly crashing. But you know what? ET was very exciting, and people put up with the technical struggles because so much cool shit was happening not from the programming, but from the relatively small, but very creative and exciting core group.

---there were far fewer official contests back then, but wow, were those fun! People were actually inspired BY Elftown . . . I certainly know I was . . . and the creative process came naturally. Those early ET contest were LOADED with participants, and it didn't matter if these participants were people who had just recently started drawing (like myself, back then) or if they were top-notch talents like [TheRogue] and [liiga] who were (and are) so possessed with mad skills it was scary. People talked to people, ideas and kind words were exchanged, and everyone involved generally speaking benefitted in some way or another. Those were good times! This could also happen again.

---Back in the day, people on council were strictly of the same mentality as the people. There was no need for bullshit, no need for politics, no need for additional, unnecessary official pages to act as buffers between council and the rest of Elftown, and never questions of people with power getting in the way of Elftown's progress. This can also happen again, and I know this is already starting to happen.

---Back in the day, nobody got special treatment. There really weren't eyebrows raised when certain people seemed to get away with everything (stuff that would get the rest of us banned!) and there was never a temptation by the people to go the vigilante route, to take matters into their own hands because what should have been done (the banning of these troublemakers who got away with everything!) was never done. No secret "Stop so-and-so" forums created out of pure bloody frustration, no loud (and ignored) objections and complaints, no nothing. As I see it the worst of this sort of thing is well in ET's past, but it most certainly did happen.

---Back in the day, there would have never been a need for stop the revolution, because those people would have had their asses handed to them immediately. Also back then, there was no need for take elftown back in its original, unadulterated context. There was only a small number of people on this website, but how they LOVED this website, and most of them understood that if you misbehaved repeatedly, you were doomed. Back then, the art thieves and [ThreeHawks]/[Soldrinker]/[Tuquah]/[3HawksBaby] were the larger-than-life Public Enemies #1. I can only hope ET returns to this state. The application system has been a fantastic plus . . . but now all the GOOD people we've lost over time ought to be encouraged to return. Elftown really suffers without them.

Anyway, wouldn't it be nice to have the current ET, with all of its wonderful technical upgrades, be complemented with the art/writing-focused people who can and did make this website so vibrant, relatively worry-free place, just a few years ago? Old school can meet new school, and if that does happen, this website just might become the well-known, well-loved haven for artsy types most of us have generally wished for, for some time. All those stats and such would permanently increase through positive exposure to the right people

(So much for short and sweet! Hey, it's me . . . )

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: Well, I just want to say one thing at this moment. I was going to message this privately, but then I decided I'd like to say it right here. I can't begin to say or express how impressed I am with one of Elftown's latest Council members just added. I admire his enthusiasm, his creative ideas and his go-get-it attitude. He is an example of what's needed here on Elftown, this infectious enthusiasm! So, I think we should all give [Ramirez] a great, big round of applause! I don't impress easily, but gees, man...Wow!

2008-08-10 [Paul Doyle]: Yes, Kudos to [Ramirez]!

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: [Paul Doyle] I think for the most part, you're right. What Elftown really needs is education and some enthusiasm and I think it can fairly easy take on some more talented artists and writers (who are already among our midsts, I'm sure). We're just a little lost, as a community. Not just individuals. I think we'll make it. With time and more brainstorming, we'll get there and be as fun and enthusiastic as we were back when Elftown was just born and starting to figure out what it was about itself.

[Artsieladie]: Thanks so much for the kind words. I think that Elftown just needed a little boost, and I was getting a little nervous waiting for such a wiki to start up and the community to be brought together again. So I just took it into my own hands and took a stab at it. I'm very happy of the results. I think it's going to inspire and enthuse more Elftowners--and if it's just one or two of them that it saves from quitting Elftown for good, or cutting back their time drastically, then it's worth it. I don't want anyone to leave ET because they don't think it's what it use to be, because it is, and it will always be. It's just a little harder to find the heart of Elftown if you're not looking. I think this wiki displays it openly.

2008-08-10 [Khronos Atmosphaera]: Whoa... this is a really great wiki [Ramirez]! I saw it in a friends mood and decided to click. I'm glad I did. I've been a member of Elftown for about 5 years, and when I first join, I had to sneak on at school, because my parents thought this was an evil place, lol! And I wasn't allowed on at home. The only reason I joined Elftown was because I was on Elfwood, and I saw it from there, and I'm glad I did join. I've meet some really awesome people here, and even if I've had my ups and downs, its always been really great.

I'd like to join, if thats okay. ^^' Or if I qualify and what not. Especially if this is try and bring Elftown back to what it was before it was over run with 'emos' art thieves, 'myspace wanna-be's' and so forth.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Welcome, [Khronos Atmosphaera].^^

2008-08-10 [Khronos Atmosphaera]: Thanks so much! Time to check out the coffee shop... >.>

2008-08-10 [Byne]: ...Wow. Very, very well said [Paul Doyle]. I'd have to agree with you for the most part.

And I agree 100% with [Artsieladie]! You rock [Ramirez]!!!

2008-08-10 [XxTsomexX]: If anyone has any contests they're running, I'll gladly join :) I've been browsing for contests to enter... I need more experience with my art.

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: You're welcome, [Ramirez] and I meant those words. :) We do need to initiate enthusiasm such as yours and make it infectious all across Elftown. :D

2008-08-10 [Byne]: Can I shamelessly advertise soemthing here? O: It isn't a contest....But the first time I've ever really put any photography up here. O:

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: For contests you might want to look at: Competitions, Art Contests, Photo Contests, Writing Contests, and MC for starters. :D

2008-08-10 [XxTsomexX]: Ah, thank you so much [Artsieladie]. I'll look through those right now.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: I did. AND I entered a contest too. The first time I ever have! 8D

2008-08-10 [Angel In Red]: I want to express my thoughts here, but I just can't come up with the right words. There is too much to say... *doesn't know where to begin*

I'll just settle on one word- Hope.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: And what a word that is, [Angel In Red]. (:

2008-08-10 [Angel In Red]: Actually I'm wrong. It's not just a word. It's a feeling, emotion, survival instinct, a door, a path and a change.


... Oh my, I feel poetic today. *runs to find notepad*

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: Great, [XxTsomexX] and you're welcome! Finding contests that are to one's tastes and entering is one way and a great way to help bring Elftown back to vibrancy. :D [Angel In Red], as long as there's hope, there's a chance! :D

2008-08-10 [Byne]: I entered TWO contests. (:

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: I think that face sums up my feelings right now. =P


wrong face, I meant this one :

2008-08-10 [Angel In Red]: Erm, you okay there Ramirez? *looks up from her notepad*

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: I'm actually not feeling like myself lately, so I think I'll probably stay out of conversations until I can recoup.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: ...You ain't gonna have no time when I'm with ya, bubba. I demand attention! xD

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Does anyone thing there should be some alternation to the things you shouldn't have in your ET House to join? Any suggestions to improve it, or make it more friendly? I don't want people to be discouraged if they happen to have one of those things in there.

2008-08-10 [Angel In Red]: I think it's fine. Those who are discouraged are the ones we're trying to keep Elftown safe from right? And you have noted that if they are discouraged by those points they should try and prove they are actually assets to this community?

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: point 3 is harsh, and I'll be changing it to a more friendly way. I was actually laughing when I wrote that.

point 4. I agree, that's why you don't have to have art up if you mention you're an art critique and not an artist.

2008-08-10 [Hendercrazy]: [windowframe] has some really valid points. Personally, as long as folks are being constructive in some way to the community... Elftown remains a fun, active place. :)

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: You know, I'm not extremely into art although I do enjoy drawing from time to time but if you look at my house I have two old MS Paint pictures on it. According to this wiki, I'm essentially an "evil MySpacer". But I am very active in the Elftown Academy and The Town Herald, I created the Elftown Archives and Remember 9-11!, and I'm one of the Guides. Yet art isn't the most important part of Elftown to me.

2008-08-10 [*Phoenix*]: I'd like to be part of this wiki!!!!!!!!
~[*Phoenix*]

2008-08-10 [Hendercrazy]: Perhaps each member could just list how they're active in the community? This way people would know what all you're involved with.

For example:

[Hendercrazy] - Fantasy Illustrator Art of Derek Henderson, Comic Artist Spazznik_Comic, Town Heralder (Comics Division) The Town Herald.

Folks could list whatever they're contributing... Poetry, art, stories, comics, music, wikis, ect. ect. ect.

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: So now you have to join and tell how you're a good Elftowner or you'll be on a hit list?! That's not... nice. *glances around fearfully*

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: So, should the application from now on just be a "write why you think you should be part of this wiki, and what you've done here." Since I do think wiki's and forums are just as important as art and writing. And you're right, [Imperator], art doesn't have to be the main focus for every Elftowner.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: Way back when I first joined ET (like, five years ago...) I was obsessed with roleplaying here. (:

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: You've ben added, [*Phoenix*] ^^

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: [windowframe], I'm actually considering that. I just don't want people who are in a spur-of-the-moment mood to just be added and then turn around and cause problems with other members, wiki's ect, ect. It's really difficult for me to explain, and I don't doubt that most, if not all people on Elftown love it (though I have strangely come across people who write how much they hate Elftown o_O).

2008-08-10 [*Phoenix*]: YAY! I feel like I just jumped in the middle of a pretty big discussion....O.O

I agree with [windowframe]!!!

2008-08-10 [Hendercrazy]: I'm just suggesting that it'd be nice to see what members that are signed up here... are doing for their community. Like a phone book index. It has nothing to do with any ranking or who's better than who. Just something folks can browse through and see if there's someone out here in the Elftown community being ACTIVE is something you may like. :)

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: Yay, [*Phoenix*]! Hiya! Glad to see you here. :D This is good, actually, discussing thoughts and ideas and how different we Elftowners are, but love Elftown just the same. There are many different ways to contribute and hopefully more will be inspired to take a more active role in this community we love. Maybe more will come to realise some way in which they can contribute, but just never realised quite how to go about it. Maybe others who have been contributing, but just didn't realise the significance of their contribution, will now know they have contributed, too. :)

2008-08-10 [Imperator]: Well if [iippo] and [windowframe] would make up their minds about Elftown - Contribution and Contribute, those could get posted up here...

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: So, should I have a "Everyone can join, and it's encouraged to make a wiki leading to things you've done in the community, things you enjoy about the community, your art, ect, and if you currently don't have anything then you should entertain your creative minds and go out and make an impact in the community!"

Also, do people feel it's a good idea to remove the password protection? I'd like to know what's being changed, so that's why I have it protected. =/

2008-08-10 [*Phoenix*]: 'Ello! I saw it and feel in love ^_^ I agree, [Artsieladie]!! Honestly, I stuff that's up there is fine with me...but that's me though O.O

2008-08-10 [Nocturnaliss]: I'm on Silverfire's page about the whole 'explain why you're a good Elftowner'... if you want to join, it means you care. More isn't really required, since you can check members' pages and see for yourself whether they fit here or not.

However, I am wondering if making an additionnal wiki-page with links to interesting contributions (such as art wikis) could be... well, interesting.

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: I could stick it in the coffee house...

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Why I believe in Elftown and I believe in Elftown because... can both have spots where wiki's can be added.

2008-08-10 [Nocturnaliss]: Why yes you could, [NOOOPE]. That might fit there better, come to think of it.

2008-08-10 [Hendercrazy]: If all of the artists here in ET want a stronger "art" presence here in ET... they should start being active in the community. Create. Create art. Create art wikis. Getting involved with other's wikis, contests and such. ;)

2008-08-10 [Paul Doyle]: [Hendercrazy] maybe we ought to make a mantra out of that? Have karma, need dharma?

2008-08-10 [Hendercrazy]: It would be awesome to see this place explode with creative passion... no matter what talents folks have (even beyond the realm of art and writing).

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: ARTTTTT

I think the real qualifying thing for being a real elftownian, is you have to be imaginative. Whether that means you're making art, writing, designing contests or inspiring people with your ideas, you don't have to shove your imagination into people's faces, but you really ought to have one in this community.

People without imaginations, not only scare me, but... I find the pitiable. And I think that's the issue. With these houses all being the same, with the same type of person and age group, it seems like lots of people here don't have any imagination. I think that's the real dividing factor.

And of course, it's the special ones who make their creative ways visible to us through wikis, art or just being a pleasure to talk to. So, this wiki should be for them, no matter who/what they are, or how they set up their house, I guess.

2008-08-10 [*Phoenix*]: Very true, [NOOOPE]!!!

2008-08-10 [Nocturnaliss]: Yeah... that really sums it up nicely.

2008-08-10 [Hendercrazy]: Ahhh... I can start to feel some passion floating around this wiki!!! :D

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: I understand what [Ramirez] is trying to impress. It's just hard to find the right words so as not offend anyone that loves Elftown, but on the other hand to kinda' let those that are here strictly for cybering and sex to get the point. I like [Hendercrazy]'s idea, but simpler like artist, roleplayer, writer, even fantasy/sci-fi admirer (other???) perhaps? Right. Make it not about position or rank and maybe especially, because the majority of any community is the general population. I think the bottom line here is, we want all those to be listed, to join, that genuinely love Elftown, that want to perpetuate this community and what it stands for, to it's fullest and its greatest potential. Everyone's positive contribution is welcome, deserves merit, regardless of its size or type. ;P

2008-08-10 [Hendercrazy]: Well said [Artsieladie]. :D

2008-08-10 [Paul Doyle]: To you people who are watching this wiki but hate everything about it: Don't confuse a place like this for "drama-mongering". Really. Honest to God. This wiki-page is recapturing what this website was supposed to be all about in the first place.

2008-08-10 [*Phoenix*]: yes, well said! You've always had a way with words! ^-^

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: [Hendercrazy]: It would be awesome to see this place explode with creative passion... no matter what talents folks have (even beyond the realm of art and writing).

[Hendercrazy]: Ahhh... I can start to feel some passion floating around this wiki!!! :D

Gosh, isn't it an ecstatic thought!!!? Ooooh! *has goosebumps* :)

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: I like the idea of a separate wiki, only 'cause I could use it to promote my stuff... heh heh.

Don't forget wiki builder.

I'd have:

Artist
Photographer
Writer
Roleplayer
Wiki Builder
Forum Spammer
Fiction Enthusiast
Guard Supporter (with reports...)

2008-08-10 [Byne]: This wiki inspired me to enter my first ET competitions. Lulz. (:

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: [Hendercrazy], thanks, but I'm surely quoting you here, aren't I?!! ;) Hmmm... I think I have a fever ... the Elftown Fever!!! Gosh, this is almost as good as ... as ...I dare not say. *giggles*

2008-08-10 [Pnelma Tirian]: I honestly didn't know there were still contests happening on Elftown. Not like contests for the whole of ET, but member-sponsored contests.

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: [NOOOPE], I'm glad you mentioned 'wiki builder', because I meant to add that one, too. :D I don't know about anyone else, but I am so excited about this! I can feel the fire and passion in the air! I say let's keep building on this! The wrinkles we can keep working on ...together as they crop up, but let's all run with this. Spread the fever! *cough cough*

2008-08-10 [Hendercrazy]: XD I've always loved ET. I think I was just a late bloomer on becoming more active here. The wikis were a learning curve. Once I figured them out and finally created my own... I then realized how creative this place could be (outside of just our ET houses) and really let the fun out.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: I used to be a lot more active here. I don't really roleplay as much anymore... But I have started to put up photography. (:

2008-08-10 [Hendercrazy]: As long as people of this community create, have fun and be themselves... the place could be limitless. Poor [Elftron] would start smoking from all of the activity! XD Reminds me... I really need to donate again. It's been awhile.

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: I Rock Elftown

I wish I had money to spare. I am sooo poor. But... colors and more images... rar.

2008-08-10 [NOOOPE]: Question! Is this page going to be remodeled soon due to recent debates and reconsidering of things?

2008-08-10 [Paul Doyle]: As soon as I get out of this temporary RL money setback I'm in (damn you, worsening economy and rising fuel/food prices) I will most certainly donate again to ET. It has been a long time since I last donated.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: Yes, I'm probably going to remodel this place a little bit, and once again, I'm looking for someone to help me do that. Unfortunately for me, I probably won't be very active for the next two weeks on Elftown (Between [Byne] coming here for a week, and me starting college and settling in) so I'd like to find someone who can help me construct this place and revise it. There is controversy for the "I believe" introduction, but I think it's kind of fitting and since all labels have been taken out, no one should feel singled out. Also for the 'requirements' for joining, I'm going to take those out and make a friendly 'everyone is welcomed!' sort of thing. But once again, this wiki is kind of controversial, so I don't know if I want to make it publicly editable, due to some fear of it being sabotaged or changes made before discussions. I think I'll leave the password on this main page, but take them off on any other ones linked from here.

2008-08-10 [Byne]: I'm easily entertained, dear. (: So I won't mind you going off to work on this here for a while, as long as I have something to do.

2008-08-10 [Ramirez]: lol.. okay. But I'm also taking you places too. I can only check it if we're at my house. =P

2008-08-10 [Byne]: True dat, true dat. (: I'm so excited!

2008-08-10 [*Phoenix*]: everything looks great, [Ramirez]!

2008-08-10 [Paul Doyle]: http://www.stumbleupon.com/url/elftown.eu/wiki.html%253Fname%253DI%252520believe%252520in%252520Elftown

2008-08-10 [Byne]: I can't see the review. What does it say?

2008-08-10 [Khronos Atmosphaera]: Every time I see comments or updates for this place, I want to sing, "I do believe in faeries! I do! I do!" XD

2008-08-10 [Artsieladie]: ...and wizards, too! ;) hehe

2008-08-10 [Khronos Atmosphaera]: xD!

2008-08-11 [Pnelma Tirian]: Heh, I can't help but think of the Dark Knight, actually.. "I believe in Harv--I mean I believe in Elftown!"

2008-08-11 [Saray]: I absolutely, definately want to be a part of this wiki. :D

2008-08-11 [Hendercrazy]: So up to this point... since [Ramirez] is being very open here and looking to revamp this wiki following all of the discussions... is everyone basically cool with the idea of it being a wiki that encourages Elftown citizens who are actively constructive for the community to sign-up here?

2008-08-11 [Hendercrazy]: By the way, thanks [Ramirez] for allowing us all to be vocal and persuasive here. :P It really shows that folks really do love Elftown and are searching their feelings to help make it an even better place for us all to enjoy. :)

2008-08-11 [Paul Doyle]: Silvie, as that fake "God" in the booth in THX-1138 would say to Robert Duvall's retching title character: "Could you be more . . . specific?" :P I'm sorry I did not respond earlier, but I was off to real-life work.

Anyway, let's work toward jettisoning tensions and working toward a common goal. That isn't easy for a lot of us, myself included. But it needs to be done. And once again, BIG Kudos to [Ramirez] for being the figurative Eye of the Storm.

2008-08-11 [Ramirez]: [Saray]: Welcome!! I'm glad you want to be a part of this. =D

[Hendercrazy], I think that was more or less my original intent, though at first I wanted 'proof' of that in some form, but after hearing more discussions and beliefs on what it really means to be active, I realized that my 'criteria' for joining wasn't any good at all, thus it was removed. So I think now that the wiki now encourages Elftowners who are active in the community to join, and if they're not active, to at least inspire them to. I've already been seeing some brand-new members (just 5 days old -snifff-) who are putting their art up and doing a great job, and I've told them how wonderful it is to see their art--because it really is. And if I come across people who don't have any art up, I might start asking if they're ever interested in putting things up. =P (I also begged a friend of mine who is a great artist to put up some of her art, and she finally did! =D)

And don't worry, everyone is welcomed to express their feelings on this wiki and how it's being conducted--whether they're for or against it. I want it to be a friendly place, and you can't have a friendly place if I'm going to dictate everything down to ever last word.. So everyone is welcomed to give suggestions!

2008-08-11 [Triola]: I would like to be added, if that is alright :)

2008-08-11 [Ramirez]: Of course! Welcome to the family. =)

2008-08-11 [Byne]: What a large family we shall be. (:

2008-08-11 [Ramirez]: I'm use to large families, and I love large families! (Thus why my main character has 12 kids XD)

2008-08-11 [Byne]: Large families are awesome. And dude, you just reminded me that I made the Croco Hunter wiki. xD

2008-08-11 [Diede.]: The more the merrier! Soon we'll have all the people that take elftown seriously here on this wiki! =3
*goes and promotes I believe in Elftown

2008-08-11 [Ramirez]: Yay! Thanks [Diede.].

2008-08-11 [Diede.]: *purrs* =3 I've been thinking.. It's time for me to put my art up too.. But it's not that good ^^;;;

2008-08-11 [Ramirez]: I love your art! Don't talk like that. DX

2008-08-11 [Diede.]: Errr^^;;;

2008-08-11 [Mr. Wonka]: Diede, your art is very good! I should know! -purrs- And plus, it's not a place to judge here, it's a place to expose our art!!!! Photos, poetry, ect...

2008-08-11 [Angel In Red]: @[Inuzama Tenshi], lol that's what I had in my mood for a few days. "I believe in ET, I do! I do!". I was referring to Peterpan myself. Lmao.

2008-08-11 [Khronos Atmosphaera]: Ha ha! Thats funny ^.^! I'm glad I wasn't the only one thinking that.

2008-08-11 [Lithium Lullaby]: 0.o wow I missed a lot, didn't I?

2008-08-11 [Mom]: [Ramirez] please add [Channy]...Thank you. =}

2008-08-11 [Ramirez]: =)

2008-08-11 [Love and Chaos]: Hey [Ramirez], can i join as well? I've been off and on ET for awhile now because of those who want to use it as a dating service. and I look forward to helping out where I can.

2008-08-11 [Ramirez]: And we're happy to have you, [Love and Chaos]. I'm looking forward to you helping out. ^^ There's also the Believers Application if you're interested in having a little voluntary job here. ^^ If not, that's great too. Just participating in future competitions and chatter here is also very much appreciated.

2008-08-11 [Imperator]: What? "Chatter"? Are we allowed to open our mouths without fear of reprimands unlike on official pages?

2008-08-11 [Byne]: I do believe that there was a section, or page rather, created specifically for people to chatter and gab and all that jazz.... (: